The CX Quantum Leap

Joana - The leadership behaviors series | EPS #62

Zanna van der Aa

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0:00 | 39:49

This is part of our Leadership Behavior Series, where we're diving deeper into some of the 21 behaviors from my new book on human-centric CX transformation: Once You See It.

In this episode, Joanna and I talk about something that I think is genuinely changing the way the best organisations approach change: adaptive transformation. And I know what you might be thinking — we already have a roadmap, we already have a plan. But here's the thing: do you want to lead transformation based on a fixed plan, or based on what's actually happening?

We explore why the traditional three-year roadmap so often runs out of steam, and what it looks like to transform in a way that can actually keep up with the world. Joanna brings such a rich perspective here — from her work on adaptive thinking to her research on divergent and convergent problem solving. 


Some things we cover:

  • Why there's no cookie-cutter model for transformation — and why that's actually a good thing
  • The three things adaptive organisations do differently: sense, respond, and redesign
  • How to build a genuine sensing capability (hint: it's not just about data)
  • The yin and yang of divergent and convergent thinking — and how to use both at the right moment
  • Why a certain percentage of failure is actually a sign your organisation is healthy
  • Practical first steps for leaders who want to become more adaptive tomorrow


What I love most about this conversation is the honesty around the hard parts. The mindset shift. The pressure of quarterly results. The leadership changes that can unravel years of progress. We don't skip over those — because that's where transformation either lives or dies.

Whether you're a CEO trying to get your organisation unstuck, or a transformation lead looking for a smarter way to drive change, I hope this gives you something concrete to take into next week.

Timestamps
(00:00) – Introduction: Why Adaptive Transformation?
(01:39) – The Problem With the Three-Year Roadmap
(05:46) – What Adaptive Transformation Actually Means
(09:18) – Sensing Change: Data, Human Signals, and AI
(14:52) – Divergent and Convergent Thinking: The Yin and Yang of Problem Solving
(16:23) – The USAA Example: Making Adaptive Thinking Everyone's Job
(19:45) – Codiwomp: Traveling Purposefully Toward a Vague Destination
(22:18) – Concentric Circles: How Real Transf

NEW! Once You See It - Executive Guide to Human-Centric CX Transformation by Dr. Zanna van der Aa is out now!
It contains a unique combination of perspectives: the CEO perspective and the CX transformation lead perspective.
And in between these two parts of the book, she also shares a chapter on the role of AI in experience.

Accelerate in Experience Academy

Ready to create more business impact with Customer & Employee Experience? Join the 6-week Accelerate in Experience Academy by Dr. Zanna van der Aa. The proven method for CX transformation that delivers measurable results in just 3 months.

🌍 Trusted in 20+ countries by 11+ global brands such as Randstad, Allianz, Zain and Egon Zehnder. Now available online.

👉 Start your journey: https://academy.zannavanderaa.com/en

More info? 
LinkedIn -> https://www.linkedin.com/in/zannavdun/
YouTube -> https://www.youtube.com/@dr.zannavanderaa
Website -> https://zannavanderaa.com/
Dutch version podcast -> https://beleving.buzzsprout.com